Cancer Myths and Urban Legends

 Laurl at ONS 

Welcome to the ONS Hot Topic Chats! Today’s expert is Wendy Vogel, who will be talking with us about any and all questions you have regarding Cancer Myths and Urban Legends. Welcome Wendy!

 whvogel 

Thank you and welcome to everyone!!

 whvogel 

What kind of burning questions do you have today?

 nurse kris 

I know you get this all the time--as do I: sugar/starch & "feeding" the tumor. DRIVES ME NUTS!

 whvogel 

Great question about sugar!!!

 whvogel 

There is a claim that one tsp of white sugar can devastate your immune system of up to 6 hrs…

 whvogel 

The claim then is that this would make you vulnerable to viruses, bacteria, cancer cell and parasites…

 nurse kris 

There's so much circulating about if people eliminate those things, it'll contain tumor growth...but I know that you can't selectively "starve" the tumor.

 whvogel 

This was published in the "Immune System Cure” by Vanderhaeghe and Bouic...

 whvogel 

There is "published information" that taking 100g of sucrose, glucose or fructose in a singe dose can cause 50% inhibition in neutrophilic phagocytosis for a few hours.

 whvogel 

But think about this...

 whvogel 

A tsp of contains 6 g of sugar. A can of soda has 6 tsps of sugar…

 whvogel 

So...if this was true.....

 whvogel 

Drinking a soft drink could suppress the immune system for up to 36 hours!!!

 nurse kris 

Yup. and anyone who has taken cell bio knows that the body breaks EVERYTHING down into sugar forms of some sort.

 whvogel 

We would (most of us) be dead from some opportunistic infection!!!

 whvogel 

In the western world our average sugar intake is 57 kg per year; about 25 full tsp per day, so we would have a suppressed immune system all the time if this were true!!

 whvogel 

Great question...thank you! I love that one as you can tell.

 nurse kris 

I get it almost every time I'm doing patient education.

 whvogel 

I even had a patient ask me about vitamin B17 ----which is laetrile… this week....hadn't heard this one in a while!!

 nurse kris 

Heard a blip about this..remind me what the claim is..?

 whvogel 

Laetrile is banned from the US, but continues to be marketed in Mexico as a cancer treatment/cure…

 kaye 

No question yet, just wanted to see what others have to say.

 whvogel 

Laetrile was widely touted in the 70's and 80's. The trade name is Amygdalin. It is a chemical in the kernels of apricot pits, apple seeds, bitter almonds, and some other fruits and nuts…

 nurse kris 

I remember now.

 whvogel 

It was first used to treat cancer patients in California in the early 50s…

 nurse kris 

Lots of "conspiracy" claims that drug companies are preventing the US Govt from using this "cure".

 whvogel 

When laetrile breaks down in the body it forms glucose, benzaldehyde and hydrogen cyanide…

 whvogel 

Patients experience nausea, vomiting, headache, and dizziness….

 whvogel 

A few have died from CYANIDE poisoning. In 1982, under NCI sponsorship, a clinical trial was held on laetrile…

 kaye 

I have a friend who went to Mexico to get laetrile many years ago. It did not help him and he spent a lot of money - not sure if others were helped.

 whvogel 

It was not found effective against cancer…

 whvogel 

In 1975 class action suit was filed to stop the FDA from interfering with the sale and distribution of laetrile…

 whvogel 

After several years, this failed and there are only a few sources of laetrile outside of the US.

 kaye 

What about the hype about ACAI and its curative power for all sorts of ailments? Anyone have any experience?

 whvogel 

Interesting- the amount of money wasted on cancer quackery is unknown...but estimated to exceed one billion dollars per year!!!

 whvogel 

ACAI berry is also called acai palm, cabbage palm and palm berry..

 whvogel 

It is purportedly used for cancer, heart disease, stroke, autoimmune disease and diarrhea....

 whvogel 

Acai may actually interfere with the actions of certain chemotherapy drugs due to its antioxidant effects…

 whvogel 

I will post some references after the webchat attached to the transcript for your use.

 whvogel 

What else are your patients talking about?

 Laurl at ONS 

Welcome - please ask your questions about myths!

 nurse kris 

New claim I just saw yesterday on Dr. Weil: bovine milk too high in estrogens, increasing cancer rate for non-vegans. Hadn't heard that before.

 whvogel 

Bovine colostrum is cow's milk secreted during the first few days following calving...

 whvogel 

It is rich in immunoglobulins, growth factors and cytokines and confers immune protection to the newborn calf…

 whvogel 

It is purportedly used for colitis, diarrhea, and immunostimulation...

 whvogel 

I am not seeing any information that has measured the amount of estrogen in this...

 nurse kris 

That's why I was confused. I couldn't find anything other than that article.

 whvogel 

There appears to be no data to support that claim...no clinical trials on this....

 Laurl at ONS 

Nurse Kris, where did you see the article?

 nurse kris 

A friend sent it to me via Dr. Weil's website...let me see if I still have the link.

 whvogel 

I will look some more...if I find anything...will post with transcript...can you send me article? You can get my email from ONS website membership data.

 whvogel 

What else are we hearing out there?

 nurse kris 

www.drweil.com/drw/u/id/QAA400175

 Laurl at ONS 

Wendy, what about shampoo causing cancer?

 whvogel 

thanks!!

 whvogel 

That is a good question about shampoo...

 steph199 

And deodorant causing CA?

 whvogel 

there was an email (watch out for those emails) that began circulation in 1998 that said sodium laureth sulfate in shampoo and other personal care products causes cancer. This is unfounded.

 mcraft 

What about cosmetics related to breast cancer? I have some patients who have heard things about that?

 whvogel 

Generally emails like this are unproven...check out www.snopes.com or wwww.quackwatch.org for any claims like this.

 whvogel 

Ok, antiperspirants!!

 whvogel 

Love that one...

 whvogel 

Antiperspirants prevent us from perspiring, thereby inhibiting the body from purging toxins from below the armpits ... that is the "theory" .... therefore the body deposits the toxins in lymph nodes, causing cancer…

 mcraft 

Not just antiperspirants but even facial cosmetics. I have one patient that buys all her cosmetics from European vendors because of the supposed chemicals in American ones that are unsafe.

 whvogel 

There was even a warning that women who apply right after saving increase the risk even more because shaving causes almost imperceptible nicks in the skin giving chemical a chance inter the body from the armpit....

 whvogel 

This is not true!!!!

 nurse kris 

I saw the "lead lipstick" email! Sheesh.

 whvogel 

Sweat contains water, urea and salt....NOT ANY TOXiNS!!! And sweat glands are not connected to the lymph nodes…

 whvogel 

The make-up question is a good one too...

 whvogel 

I have noted a lot of companies, particularly on the web promoting their "safe" products...it is a huge moneymaking venture

 nurse kris 

Isn't it always related to $$? :)

 steph199 

What about the pads that are placed on the bottom of the feet, during the night, they pull off all the body impurities.......while you sleep?

 hrmnytlz 

Since we are talking cosmetics, what about hair color-we know medications are absorbed topically-what about these other chemicals?

 kaye 

Our bodies are very powerful in healing themselves if given the right ingredients. But the diet that most Americans eat is not healthy. Even with the environmental assault, if we have the right ammunition, most disease can be prevented.

 whvogel 

The FDA regulates most things that offer some "medical" claim....even like tampons...

 whvogel 

If there were any harmful ingredients...the FDA would not allow it....

 whvogel 

Hence our MSDS!!! (don’t we love em!)

 mcraft 

But are cosmetics regulated by the FDA or any other of the supposed herbal type remedies?

 whvogel 

Lead lipstick: the claim is if you rub a gold ring on the lipstick and the color of the lipstick changes to black, then it has lead in it....completely untrue…

 whvogel 

I will list some further info for your reference after the chat...

 whvogel 

Never heard of the pads....sound physically impossible!!! I'll look that one up.

 steph199 

Avon sells them and they are advertised on TV.

 nurse kris 

Seen the foot pads thing...it's funny.

 whvogel 

There is no pathophysiologic way that could happen....

 kaye 

I tried them for a couple of nights and indeed I got some foul smelling black stuff in them, but not sure it actually came from my body, or if there was something in the pads themselves.

 whvogel 

I will do some research on it!!!

 hrmnytlz 

FDA approval-can we trust them given the medications that have been removed from the market?

 kaye 

I agree, not sure we can trust the FDA or any other government agency!!

 whvogel 

The question about the FDA and cosmetics....most of the ingredients that are regulated by FDA are medicinal or by EPA if chemical...so we are safe!!!

 whvogel 

Now the hair dye…

 mcraft 

And that is what causes our patients to be so paranoid and mistrusting of drug companies and go for the "natural" stuff.

 nurse kris 

Remind your patients that arsenic is natural, too.

 whvogel 

There… has been an association between hair dye and NHL, this was a retrospective study

 whvogel 

…at Yale university, pulled data from 4 published case control studies….

 whvogel 

…about 10,000 people total...

 whvogel 

…30% increased NHL ( non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma)  risk among women who started using hair dye before 1980.

 whvogel 

So bottom line is we don’t truly know....

 whvogel 

Beauticians should be aware there may be risk...regular health care checkup…

 whvogel 

We don’t really know...it could play a role in NHL or other immune related cancers.

 whvogel 

There was a comment earlier about whether patients can trust the government...etc.

 whvogel 

That is a common thing that I hear...

 whvogel 

We have to consider though that if the government or pharma was hiding a cure...their family and friends would have a lesser rate of cancer or deaths from cancer than other people....not so...

 whvogel 

Also, we all know that if there was a cure....our pharma would be selling in the US for BIG BUCKS....LOL

 nurse kris 

You'd think they'd want to cure them so they can be taxed longer? LOL!

 whvogel 

LOL

 steph199 

What.........the Gov folks aren't paying their taxes now!!

 nurse kris 

Tee-hee!! No doubt!!

 whvogel 

I have some good websites for your use in finding answers to these questions...

 mcraft 

I have a patient who claims toe fungus is a cause of breast cancer....

 whvogel 

For herbals, vitamins, etc...go to memorial sloan kettering site..it is great...www.mskcc.org/mskcc/html/11570.cfm

 whvogel 

For email and accuracy.... www.snopes.com

 nurse kris 

LOVE my snopes!!

 whvogel 

For alternatives and weird treatments and claims go to www.quackwatch.org

 whvogel 

there is also www.truthorfiction.com and www.scambusters.org

 whvogel 

The NCI, ACS and FDA also have information to help patients decide what to believe.

 whvogel 

The toe fungus question ... I am looking....

 whvogel 

Do you know where she might have heard this? Patients get some weird things from chat rooms (not like ours of course!!)

 whvogel 

It is important to steer our patients toward reputable websites and sources of information.....

 mcraft 

She got it from another patient who happens to be married to a man in the media so it takes on an aura of believability that it doesn't deserve.

 whvogel 

I can't find ANYTHING about toe fungus and breast cancer...

 mcraft 

I really think it is the whole issue of "correlation does not imply causation", if x % of women have toe fungus and x % have breast cancer, must be related.

 whvogel 

There is some info on fungus in BREAST IMPLANTS...maybe the husband is confused!!!

 whvogel 

Good thought.

 mcraft 

Toes, breast implants... so easy to get them confused...

 whvogel 

LOL

 whvogel 

You guys are funny!!! Have another cup of coffee!!

 whvogel 

What about other things you have heard???

 mcraft 

Oh, but what about coffee and cancer?!

 nurse kris 

Do NOT take my coffee away

 kaye 

Please not coffee!! Can't do without it.

 whvogel 

Coffee and cancer...hmmmm

 whvogel 

Coffee enemas have been touted as a cure/treatment for cancer..

 whvogel 

I don’t think you are taking it that way though!!

 whvogel 

It does bring up the topic of colon cleansing...

 kaye 

I think the caffeine causes lumps in breast tissue and maybe that is why people think it causes cancer.

 nurse kris 

Wow...wrong end...

 whvogel 

Gerson (the Gerson treatment) prescribed coffee enemas at the frequency of one every 3-4 hours as part of cancer treatment.

 whvogel 

It said that it helped stimulate flow of bile, increasing rate of excretion of toxic products form the body…

 mcraft 

Easier just to do the heel pads from Avon

 nurse kris 

Prob. more comfortable too

 whvogel 

The FDA has regulated colon cleansing as class II medical device only for medically indicated reasons.

 whvogel 

LOL

 hrmnytlz 

I attended a conference focusing on American Indians with a breakout session with spiritual healers-They claimed to cure cancer if no radiation or treatment had already been given. Gave anecdotal results of 100% cure-as long as pt did as they were instructed and participated in work of cure. They did state any specific diagnoses.

 whvogel 

Red Bull email....supposedly contained a chemical that causes brain tumors...

 whvogel 

Not supported by data although it has actually been banned in some other countries.

 whvogel 

Anecdotal....always have to be careful with that...

 mcraft 

Why has it been banned in some countries?

 whvogel 

That is a great example of what we hear everyday...I try to teach patients the difference between clinical trials and anecdotal information...hard concept for desperate patients.

 whvogel 

Ok the red bull....Denmark, Malasia and France banned citing too high levels of caffeine...

 whvogel 

The chemical purported to cause cancer has not been found to be toxic.

 whvogel 

Only coffee the PURE caffeine for me

 Laurl at ONS 

No, chocolate for me!!

 whvogel 

amen

 mcraft 

Amen sister

 whvogel 

You are all too fun!!!

 mcraft 

And we know humor does not cause cancer!

 whvogel 

Actually laughter stimulates our natural endorphins!! Some data suggests that this stimulates immune system...one of our own treasured, yet not scientifically supported ideas....yet I hold it dear...

 whvogel 

hmmmm.....

 Laurl at ONS 

DON"T stop asking questions! But when you can please take a moment to cut and paste this URL into your browser and take our very brief survey - we’d love to hear what you think of these chats! The URL is http://research.zarca.com/k/RsTUTRsSRSsXYTTXsPsP .. Cut and paste into your browser click and take the survey- thank you! You can also find this URL in the transcript of this chat which will be posted in the next day or so.

 whvogel 

Our own biases...

 whvogel 

Any one have any other burning questions???

 whvogel 

Bring em on...

 whvogel 

Heard the one about power lines?

 nurse kris 

Oh yeah

 steph199 

Caffeine has been reported to decrease tooth decay, diabetes, Parkinson’s and a laundry list of other problems...........Real Age has reported some of these.

 whvogel 

There was a single flawed epidemiological study in 1979...and two books written on this....alleging the government was covering it up…

 mcraft 

How about cell phones?

 nurse kris 

Here we go...that darn gov’t again

 whvogel 

…Subsequent epidemiologic studies have failed to find a consistent or significant effect and also refute by Oak Ridge University, the American Physical Society the National Research Council and the NCI!!!!

 whvogel 

Ok cell phones...

 steph199 

Well, since a large population of us seems to walk around with the cell phone growing out of their ears, this will be a good case study in a few years.

 whvogel 

There was actually a director of the Univ of Pittsburgh Cancer Institute that sent a warning to his staff about cell phone usage and risk of cancer…

 mcraft 

Is there data to support that?

 nurse kris 

Wasn’t it something about MODERATE users having high risk vs low/high users?

 whvogel 

He was basing his alarm on "early unpubished data" stating that it "takes too long to get answers from science" and he believes that people should "take action now"…

 whvogel 

No other major academic cancer research institutions have agreed...

 mcraft 

That seems a bit unscientific....

 whvogel 

The Univ of Utah looked at 9 studies....and thousands of brain tumor patients and concluded that there is no overall increased risk of brain tumor among cell phone users....BUT don’t tell my teenage daughter!!!

 whvogel 

Bottom line...no data to support this!!!

 mcraft 

Awesome, but tell her to watch out for toe fungus....

 whvogel 

Neither high nor low use has been proven....

 nurse kris 

Teens are already brain damaged...

 whvogel 

Amen on the brain damage!! (men too....heeeheee LOL)

 whvogel 

LOL

 mcraft 

Thanks! Gotta go

 Laurl at ONS 

I HATE to say it, but our time has ended! You guys have been awesome!

 nurse kris 

It's been fun!

 whvogel 

Thank you all VERY much for a very very enjoyable chat!! Have a GREAT day!!

 Laurl at ONS 

Please do complete the survey when you can - and come the final chat, Monday at 9pm EASTERN.

 Laurl at ONS 

Have a great day!